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November - December 2007, Mikis Theodorakis
L.M. First, I would like to tell you Mr. Theodorakis that it’s a great honour and pleasure for me and my company at Radio M.T. It is also my pleasure to talk with people who have interests, a fact that distinguishes them especially today that our country passes through a difficult and critical situation. L.M. Which could be your answer to the question why we come to existence? M.T. This is something that nobody knew, knows or will ever know. And underneath, it proves our insignificance before the unexplored will of the Universal Laws of Creation. L.M. You are right. This we will never learn. However, since we come to existence, we could be happy. What is Happiness Mr. Theodorakis? M.T. First of all, to live; to breathe, to see, to hear, to taste and if you are a human, to think, to dream, to wish and to afford. L.M. How could we be led to the magical neighbourhood of happiness? M.T. Happiness is a totally subjective feeling, depending on the constitution and value of each person. L.M. Can anyone finally approach it? M.T. Certainly. L.M. You have said that “If I look at my life I will find faces, smiles, gestures, colours, emotions to partner me like migratory birds…” I imagine that these images that you have described so wonderfully both with lyrics and music, must constitute important islets of happiness for you. M.T. Indeed. I can say that life has been generous with me. Until 18 years old, I lived in the Greek countryside meeting cities, places and people quite different from each other. So, after the Aegean Sea (Chios, Mytilene, Syros), I met the Ionian Sea (Argostoli), Epirus (Ioannina), Peloponnese (Patrai, Pyrgos, Tripoli). These abrupt changes, making me feel rootless in really tender years, on the one hand enriched me but on the other hand hurt me, sharpening my sensitivity to the limit. It was not until the age of 12 that I discovered music, since when I never deserted it and it never deserted me. And this has been the secret of my happiness. There followed thousands of adversities (that of course you know) and which led me to new acquaintances with our beautiful country. Nevertheless, because in this case I was “rootless” too, it made me meet new grievances and consequently fresh gain towards an acuter sharpening of my sensitivity in favor of music that then still did not desert me slightly, not even in the bitterest moment. So, I met again the beauty of the Aegean in the striking Ikaria and in the rocky Makronisos. These things happened during the domestic warfare. However, junta later did not forget me. So, they sent me –for a change- to the mythical mountains of Arcadia, to breathe the life-giving oxygen of the firs. All these helped me be myself; me and music. In other words, the biggest, the most boundless happiness for a mortal. L.M. Almost always, however, the islets or the moments of happiness deteriorate from cruel reality that pivots on money. Why Mr. Theodorakis money has become the most important idol for most people? M.T. It is because human is on the one hand insecure and on the other hand greedy. Money furthermore satisfies both these needs. That is to say, it gives independence and power. L.M. Taking music into consideration, what is music and how deeply can it influence the human soul? Can music contribute to the happiness of human? M.T. It is one of the most authentic human characteristics, which distinguishes a human being from other forms of life. Namely, it is with music that one proves that is a human indeed. Only armed with culture and education one can seek happiness in the area of debt, spirit and art. Given that there is the path of the beast that we all have inside also if and when it awakens and prevails, then it offers the brutal pleasure (happiness?) that leads to the bestial satisfaction that makes wild instincts joyfully dance in front of brutish actions. Might there be happier human beasts than those who can torture and diffuse pain and death? L.M. Do you believe that music helps to understand the world? M.T. According to the Pythagoreans and the Neopythagoreans like me, it is only music. L.M. A little while ago I received an e-mail from some lady that does her PhD in the Panteion University concerning an experiment of a psychotherapeutic team through art and music from the internet. This lady asked me to put a link with Radio Art in the site of the team and also mentioned that during the psychotherapy the members of the team listen to music from Radio Art. This really impressed and puzzled me much. Can music play a therapeutic role? M.T. This I cannot know, because it necessitates special, scientific knowledge. However, because in “psychic illness” there is the word psyche, I will tell you Pythagoras’ opinion about soul, in order to see how he describes it and what role he considered it to have. The Pythagoreans had explored and linked their harmonic theory of the planet spheres with Music and Psyche. The relationship between psyche and planets pertains to an internal immersion of a higher nature to a stellar itinerancy to the roots of the being, where the tragic agony of human before the last’s powerlessness to apperceive the inconceivable of Infinity and Boundlessness converts into pain, from which one tries to set free (…) by means of psychic ecstasy. Is the alleged psychically ill one step beyond the sane? Are they “touched” by the -definitely hyper logical- “inconceivable of Infinity and Boundlessness” that helped them in a “psychic ecstasy” from which we sane people try to draw? L.M. Is there any of your works that you distinguish and why? M.T. From the beginning, I tried to configure a set of musical works that are intertwined forming acoustic constellations, which collectively conclude to the creation of a Musical Galaxy. Even though I wasted precious time in the community, however I managed to reach almost my boundaries creating a big space with works that I wanted and the way I wanted. So now I can deem that my works form a WHOLE, in which every part has its appropriate position, plays its own role and therefore you cannot differentiate them. L.M. What you said about the link of your work to a musical galaxy was quite interesting. I would like to abide for a while by what you said about the community. Do you consider that you lost precious time interfering with the community? M.T. Certainly. Again this is something that I realized very late. That is to say when I realized that both my own as well as my comrades’ and fellow contesters’ sacrifices had been infinitely bigger than the ideals we fought for. For decades we did nothing but scatter through our bodies, our flesh, blood and pain to see finally, whoever finally survived, half of all these sucked by the ground, oblivion and ingratitude along with the other half scythed by others, failing unfortunately to understand and appreciate the quintessence of all these visions that had been far too high for their low stature. I cannot of course deny my life. Furthermore, I must say that not only could I not do differently but also that my struggle for the community filled me with happiness in a different way than Music. But now that I see it all from some distance, I wonder if it was worth to contribute so much against my music, with which I believe that I would make much more interesting things, if I had the due time. Plus I must say that the ghosts of the works that I did not do torture me unbearably and when you see me complaining for many immaterial things, I do it perhaps to hide the real truth, because naturally it is impossible for me to go back in time … L.M. Is there a part of your work that you would like to have been played more times and if so, which is it and why do you think it has not been played? M.T. My symphonic music, to be exact my Symphonies that are in fact oratorios and principally my “Tetralogy” (“Medea”, “Elektra”, “Antigone” and “Lysistrata”) that constitutes the culmination of my musical creation. L.M. During your exciting life, you have met and cooperated with some of the most enlightened people of your generation but also of younger. I would like you to distinguish some of them and to mention which of their fields of thought affected your own thought and creation. M.T. In my life, indeed, I have always been open to extrinsic influences, certainly these that born inside feelings of admiration. I never hesitated to use the verb “admire”, even if it was to speak for a contemporary of mine. Moreover I admit I envied and envy still only something that can bring about my admiration from the classics to the contemporaries. So, I owe a part of my evolution to them that of course I studied deeply -as well as all the great people- trying to absorb and make mine every new element that I consider great. In this attempt it is natural to exist in my work many unassimilated elements, something that we shall find in all the authors, even the greatest ones. After all I said, I think that it is unnecessary to make reference to names, once something like it requires great responsibility, attention and space… L.M. You are right when you do not want to mention names. I would like us to move backward a little in our dialogue, to the point where you told me that you belong to the Neopythagoreans. As far as I know, the Neopythagoreans represent the ideal of Pythagorean life, to be exact purity, wisdom, universal tolerance and approach to the divine through numbers. Isn’t it? M.T. In simpler words, it is to live consciously. That is to say to know our origin and life; who we are finally and what our relationship with the Laws of Life is at a planetary level. L.M. What is your relationship with the divine? Do you consider religion divine, every religion? Maybe something higher M.T, The concept of Divinity differs according to nation and individual, just like the reasons that cause the need to appeal to this. There is a big spectrum from the simplest feeling to the highest and most complex, from the most prosaic to the most mental. Usually, various religions come to serve and satisfy this profound human need. For me, however, there are other roads to follow in quest for the divine besides religion, like for example Philosophy and Art. L.M. On which philosophical axis should education move in an ideally civilized country? M.T. Generally I would say, around the humanistic education axis. Especially for us, Greeks, I would add also the word “Greek” with centre the diachronic Greek element from Homer and Pythagoras to the contemporary intellectuals and Greek mental authors. And of course every person and action that connects to the humane and Greek character. L.M. Which is the biggest mistake that all contemporary politicians make in your opinion? M.T. That they have consciously quitted from visions, specifically the macro politics and they are involved in current affairs, in particular the micro politics. This results in substituting the steam engine of advance that leads people forward by means of an araba, who condemns the lifestyle to immobility and transforms everyday life to an endless morass. L.T. We have seen many people, who when they power, they come closer to evil. Do you agree? Why does it happen? M.T. Power constitutes the reason of all afflictions that humanity has endured and still endures. It is this office that transforms Angels to Demons, Saviors to Tyrants and rebels to Tsars. Power means violence and war and until today it seems invincible like cancer. L.M. Are you an optimist for the immediate future? M.T. Exactly for this fact I cannot be an optimist. L.M. Which is the most interesting thing that your eyes have seen until today? M.T. The Parthenon of Ictinus. L.M. What would you like to say to the youths, to all the youths, even to these who study and to these who work but also to these who are indignant and disappointed from the social system and they break shop windows at the first opportunity? M.T. To lean inside responsibly and try to know reality that surrounds them as objectively as it can be. To study, to analyze, to learn, to see without blinders and creeds and to take their lives in their hands, seriously and responsibly with the only power that people have until now; co-ordination, unity and massiveness. Only then will they discover the right form of assertion and fight, after they end up united of course in the right targets. L.M. If you went back in time, would you delete some things that you have done? M.T. I don’t think so. Just like what we say in chess, I consider all my moves “compulsory” (force). L.M. Is there a way not to fear death? M.T. We must fear death. Otherwise we would not be normal and alive. For example, when I think that after me Hymettus will still exist, just like it was at the time when Aeschylus’ and Socrates’ eyes looked at it and a thousand hundred years ago... I envy it and rebel. But what can I do? L.M. The American poet Allen Ginsberg has said “that death is an aspect of void…Void is present at all times in life”. Do you agree with this? M.T. It’s a little difficult for me to conceive this meaning. For me there is no mystery in death. We just come back where we came from. Dust to Dust. L.M. Is there a question to which you would like to have found an answer in your life but you haven’t until today? M.T. Of course. Who and why brought me here, since that someone is going to take me back again…If it was a joke, L.M. I do not know who brought you here Mr. Theodorakis, but whoever did that, he made a great present, not only in Greece but also all around the world. With your music you made our hearts move in these islets of happiness that we discussed beforehand. And I am certain that these feelings will be received through your work by the following generations too. M.T. Thank you. I would just like to add that I valued, took delight in and honored with my wholeness the gift of life. L.M. How would you like your work to be treated? M.T. With love. L.M. I find this simple, almost one-word answer exceptional. Maybe this word can heal everything. Do you believe this? M.T. I know that most people for various reasons let the real life pass by unnoticeably. And they leave without knowing how important it is to live, to see, to hear, to taste, to love and to discover the beauty of life even in the slightest detail; the various colors, fragrant, music, east and west, the moon and the dome of the sky with the galaxies, the blue sea and the challenge of the horizons. To want and to dare. To get up and fall down. To rejoice and to ache… What are all these? The gift of life! And which is its core that adjusts harmony inside and around? Love! L.M. Thank you very much. M.T. The pleasure is mine, Mr. Mitropoulos
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Mikis Theodorakis of Cretan descent, was born in Chios Greece, on 29 July 1925. He spent his childhood years in different provincial cities of Greece like Mytilene, Cephallonia, Pyrgos, Patra and mainly Tripolis. Since that time it became apparent that his life would be shared equally by music and his shrugs championing for the benefit of Man. In Tripolis, at the age of just seventeen, he presents his first concert with his work Kassiane and takes part in the resistance against the occupying forces. In the great demonstration of 25 March 1943, he is arrested for the first time by the Italians and is tortured. He escapes to Athens, joins the National Liberation Front (EAM) and fights against the Nazi occupying forces. At the same time he studies music at the Athens Conservatory under Professor Philoctetes Economides. After the liberation, the Greek civil war breaks out. He goes underground, is exiled to the island of Ikaria, and twice to the island of Makronissos and is hospitalized. Finally he graduates from the Athens Conservatory in 1950 - his diploma is in harmony, counterpoint and fugue. In 1954 he wins a scholarship and goes to Paris for studies at the Conservatoire. He studies musical analysis under Olivier Messiaen and orchestra direction under Eugene Bigot. During the period 1954-60 Theodorakis is intensely active in the realm of European music. He composes music for the Ludmilla Tcherina Ballet, for the Covent Garden, the Stuttgard Ballet and for the cinema. In 1957 he is awarded the First Prize at the Moscow Festival contest by Shostakovich. In 1960 he establishes himself in Greece. He has already set to music "The Epitaph" by Yannis Ritsos, which marks his "turning point" to the popular song. He founds the "Small Symphony Orchestra of Athens" and presents many concerts throughout Greece, in an effort to familiarize the audiences with the masterpieces of symphonic music. After the murder of the Parliament Member Grigoris Lambrakis, "The Lambrakis Youth" is founded and Theodorakis is elected President. At the same time he is elected Parliament Member of the United Democratic Left party (EDA). He is arrested in August of 1967. He is imprisoned in isolation in the notorious Bouboulina street security prison and afterwards in the Averoff prison. There follow the great hunger strike, hospitalization, release from prison, house arrest, exile with his family on mountainous Zatouna in Arcadia, Oropos camp. All this time he is incessantly composing. And he succeeds in sending abroad through various channels, many of his new works, which are performed by Maria Farantouri and Melina Merkouri. At the Oropos camp his health deteriorates seriously. A surge of protest is mounted abroad. Personalities like Arthur Miller, Laurence Olivier, Yves Montand and others champion his liberation. Finally, under this pressure, in April 1970, he is released and goes to Paris. While abroad, Theodorakis devotes his entire time barnstorming all over the world with concerts, meetings with country leaders and personalities, interviews and statements about the fall of the dictatorship and the return of democracy in Greece. His concerts become a tribune of protest and vindication also for other people confronted with similar problems: Spaniards, Portuguese, Iranians, Kurds, Turks, Chileans, Palestinians. His conviction has always been that freedom and democracy are indispensable prerequisites for the strengthening of peace. For war is avoided only by free people who alone can determine their own destiny. In 1972 he visits Israel and gives concerts. He has a meeting with the Vice-President Alon who asks him to carry a message to Arafat. Immediately afterwards he meets Arafat to whom he delivers the message of the Government of Israel and makes efforts to persuade him to start discussions with the other side. Since then, he played many times the role of the informal ambassador between the two sides. It is significant that in 1994 in Oslo, the signature of the agreement between Israel and the Palestinians in the presence of Peres and Arafat, was celebrated by a performance of "Mauthausen" (which in the meantime has become in Israel a "national song") and the "Hymn for Palestine" which Theodorakis composed. This performance was given in recognition of Theodorakis' contribution to the cause of peace in that geographical area. He also visits Algeria, Egypt, Tunisia, Lebanon and Syria in an effort to reinforce the dialogue between the warring parties. In 1976 he founds the Movement for Culture and Peace and gives concerts throughout Greece. In 1983 he is awarded the Lenin Prize for Peace. In 1986, something is realized which he had supported in his interviews since 1970: the creation of committees for the Greek-Turkish friendship, in Greece under his presidency and in Turkey with the participation of eminent intellectuals such as Aziz Nessin and Yasser Kemal. Theodorakis gives in Turkey many concerts, attended mainly by young people bringing slogans in support of the friendship between the two peoples. Later on, he assumes again the role of the informal ambassador for peace, carrying messages of the Greek Prime-ministers A. Papandreou and K. Mitsotakis to the Turkish government. Also, in 1986 (after the Chernobyl catastrophe) he realizes a great concert tour throughout Europe against nuclear power. It was due to his initiative that in 1988, two congresses for peace are organized in Tübingen and Cologne, Germany. In these congresses he has the opportunity to present his theory on free time and its importance in the development of free people. In 1990 he gives 36 concerts throughout Europe under the aegis of Amnesty International. He continues giving concerts for the cause of solar energy (under the aegis of Eurosolar), against illiteracy, against drugs, etc. At the same time, he fights for the human rights in other countries and especially in the neighboring countries of Albania (which he visits also as a Minister for the sake of Greek minority rights) and Turkey. As President of the International Committee in Paris, he makes successful efforts for the liberation of the Turkish opposition leaders Koutlou and Sargin. He proposes the organization at Delphi of a Pan-European Congress for Peace and submits to the Greek government a project plan for a "Cultural Olympiad". He founds a committee of support and assistance to the Kurdish people. During the following years his operas "Elektra" (1995) and "Antigone" (1999) are presented. At the same time, he develops numerous activities abroad (Europe, South Africa, America) and makes statements to all important events of this period (Greek-Turkish friendship, earthquakes, bombardments in Yugoslavia, affair Ocalan, war in Afghanistan, war in Iraq etc.). In the same year, he is a candidate for the Peace Nobel Prize. The political and intellectual leadership of Greece and Cyprus supports unanimously his candidature, while in Norway, continuously letters arrive in the offices of Committee for the Nobel Prize from all parts of the world issued from personalities, institutions and simple citizens. In 2002 his opera "Lysistrata", is performed as a genuine anthem for Peace. In 1998, during a tour in USA and Canada for the support of a Cultural Center of the Americans of Greek descent, the President and the Faculty of the Quebec University receive him with a unanimous citation and award to him the honorary doctorate for his contribution to culture and his struggles for the cause of Man. Mikis Theodorakis was prolific in all genders of music: operas, symphonic music, chamber music, oratorios, ballets, choral church music, music for the ancient Greek Drama, music for the theater, for the cinema, artistic popular songs and meta-symphonic works. He has also written many books which were translated into many languages.
PRINCIPAL WORKS OF MIKIS THEODORAKIS
1. Song Cycles 2. Music for the Theatre 3. Music for the ancient Greek Drama 4. Music for the Cinema 5. Oratorios 6. Symphonic works and Chamber music 7. Ballets 8. Operas
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